Author Topic: GH2: Really Playing  (Read 3877 times)

Offline Joseph Hewitt

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GH2: Really Playing
« on: January 06, 2008, 12:19:37 am »
Last night I tried playing GH2 for real. This is my third time doing so- the first two times were cut short because of bugs discovered in the campaign. My character is a randomly generated construction worker from Xianxao Spinner. Here are my first thoughts.

- Mecha combat does seem to be more difficult than in GH1. My character has Piloting +4 and Gunnery +4, which should be fairly average, and combat was very hard at first.

- Enemy AI is very dumb, and the AI movemode switcher doesn't appear to work properly. This could explain why certain flying mecha will spontaneously crash in space. I thought I solved this problem before but I guess not...

- The dungeons are empty! More special rooms, dangers and rewards are needed. On the plus side, the new monster generator provides a different mix of monsters than the original but it seems nicely balanced.

- The core story needs more components. Most of the time, I got the "Friend Joins Aegis" plot point.

- SF:0 energy weapons should use more energy than they do now. There's almost no reason to get the power backpack or other energy upgrades.

- There need to be more plot-based missions. I think the missions should be harder to get than they are now; the difficulty target for being offered a mission should be related to the difficulty rating of the mission itself.

- The quest system works beautifully, most of the time.

- Xianxao Spinner often has at least two black markets; in the current game, it has three black markets plus a number of criminal shopkeepers. The first shopkeeper in the Cavalier's Club had Toxin Grenades for sale, for crying out loud. I know this is just the whim of the RNG but anyhow it's strange.

- I think there are too many shopkeepers, even though part of the idea for the spinners is that they're ultra-urban areas and Xianxao spinner is meant to be a trading hub.

Sorry for not posting more lately, but I'll explain shortly. Does anyone else have any more thoughts about the GH2 RPG campaign?

Offline Anticheese

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« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2008, 02:12:47 am »
Quoting: Joseph Hewitt

- The core story needs more components. Most of the time, I got the "Friend Joins Aegis" plot point.


You mean there is another one? ;)

Quoting: Joseph Hewitt

- I think there are too many shopkeepers, even though part of the idea for the spinners is that they're ultra-urban areas and Xianxao spinner is meant to be a trading hub.


I agree, there are way too many shops and many of them sell exactly the same items as the one next to them. How would you make the shops more distinctive?

--

I reckon it's pretty cool how you can fly around a spinner, do a mission and come back in..But most of the time I can't get back in and manually flying to another spinner is suicidal.

Suggestion 1: Distress call: Should you find yourself in deep space or up shit creek without a paddle, just activate this piece of equipment (Possibly in the special abilities function?) and someone will be sent to tow you towards the nearest port (for a fee of course). Possibly make it attract pirates after the first couple of uses, perhaps use it to attract pirates as a part of a mission?

Suggestion 2: Autopilot/Navcomp: Space is currently near-impossible to navigate. Perhaps a piece of software/hardware (standard issue software?)  would allow you to fly to a specified area of space..

This has the potential to be useful for a bit more than dodging the shuttle fares..Perhaps it could mark down important locations you bump into along the way or are told about?

Example 1: En route between two spinners you notice a large mass on your scanners. You decide not to investigate it but mark it down for further notice.

Example 2: You acquire a vague set of co-ordinates that may contain a derelict spacecraft or valuables. Unfortunately due to drift the co-ordinates are inaccurate. A successful check (Science? Piloting?) will narrow the range down a bit more, but in any case it will be marked down on your map as a large area.

Example 3: The map could contain information on your destination. As much as I hate to bring in an example as it would make it seem like a ripped idea..Kind of like how in Mass Effect you get a bit of background information on your destination

--

Thoughts? Opinions?

Offline Joseph Hewitt

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« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2008, 05:37:32 am »
It's really no wonder that the core story repeats. Look in the series directory at how much content has been written for the core story, and compare this to the amount that has been written for the quests. The good thing about writing quests is that I have an objective standard for how many components are needed: If I start a new adventure and any of the cities or NPCs fail to generate quests, I need to add more. For the core story, there is no such metric.

I've been thinking, though- it's not so important for an individual NPC to have a completely different core story each time; what is important is for different NPCs have very different core stories.

I may need to add some more descriptors to the story generator. Right now there are a lot of state descriptors but really only two plot descriptors- the plot state and the player's task. As I learned in GH1, the plot generator works best when there's interplay between several different descriptors. That's not happening in GH2, since the plot state always takes precedence over the PC's task. I've been toying with the idea of adding an episode descriptor in addition to the plot descriptor. This episode descriptor would describe the nature of the current episode independently of the plot state; at the end of each episode the episode state will typically be reset to a default value. Examples of episode states could be things like "find more information", "take a vacation from adventure", "stop enemy from doing something", and so on. A task could thereafter draw its component from either the list for the plot state or the list for the episode state. I'll have to run some simulations of this to see how it works out.

Quoting: Anticheese
I agree, there are way too many shops and many of them sell exactly the same items as the one next to them. How would you make the shops more distinctive?

One way would be to add more shop persona fragments. Right now there's a decent variety of armor and weapon stores, but only one or two different doctors, mechanics, and mecha shops. I think the best course, though, would be reducing the overall number of shops- the only type of shop that really benefits from having multiple copies in the same city is the weapon shop (plus maybe the mecha shop, as long as some of the shops belong to different factions).

Another good idea would be to include more non-random shopkeepers- there are already a few of these. Some of them could be placed in specific locations (such as Aveyhar, who is always found at the Privateer's Club) while others could be randomly placed (such as Dana, who appears somewhere in the L5 Alliance or Free Commerce States).

This brings up another issue I didn't mention above: The unique scene content mechanism appears to be spending the unique content too quickly. I don't have a good mechanism to spread the unique content out, other than favoring non-unique content over unique content when generating a map.

Quoting: Anticheese
I reckon it's pretty cool how you can fly around a spinner, do a mission and come back in..But most of the time I can't get back in and manually flying to another spinner is suicidal.

The unenterable spinner problem should be fixed in the next release; speaking of which, I should make the next release soon, before I break anything else.

The world map needs to be completely redone. I've said it before, and now I'm saying it again. I think I'll add a navigator/autopilot function, similar to that used in Fallout and other games. I think I'll also have hidden locations on the world map which don't show up on the navigator until either someone tells you about them or you discover them manually.

Offline Onisuzume

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« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2008, 09:08:37 am »
A Fallout-like navigation system would be pretty sweet.
As long as it automatically updates when you find a major normal location such as a new spinner/city...

Also, is it possible to get a shop that only sells faction specific stuff?
And if so, how? ^^

Still, I wouldn't add more than two shops of the same type to a city, unless additional ones would sell faction-specific stuff while the others don't.

Offline Francisco Munoz

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« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2008, 12:03:25 pm »
Ideas for unique shops...

1) Robotic shop... selling misc stuff (repair fuel, electronics...) that can train you in robotics or sell one or 2 robotic pets (outside of normal range of pet shops, posted some code sample some time ago).
You need some skills/minor quest to unlock the training
(I really need to port my robotic code to new versions and post it, allos you to choose a desired form and a focus like speed, defense... for your robot project)
There should be a couple of extra bots around the owner (Cleaning one + other)

2) A mining supplies shop... with extra explosives.

Offline Albijoe

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« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2008, 12:44:50 pm »
In real life there can be almost identical shops right next to each other; one will sell something slightly cheaper than another (or sell a specific type of thing), others will have random sales, all to attract customers.  There's not usually more than a few, though, or they can't get enough business for all of them.

You could have a random increase or decrease to one subtype of item in each shop (like ammunition, or hardened armor) and possibly time-based "sales" (generated with the shop, reoccurring monthly or quarterly).  I'm thinking not more than 20% decrease in cost.  This would make the shops more interesting for those who looked around, and can be ignored for those who want to shop in one place.

  Perhaps a map item to show the sale would be appropriate.

Offline macksting

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« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2008, 02:27:24 pm »
Maybe there should be random sales events.

Offline palefire

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« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2008, 06:19:05 pm »
Sometimes I run into three gyms squeezed together in one mall, sometimes none at all in the entire L5 space. I have yet to see a monk shop. When I want software, I run into electronic shops that sell nothing but computers and powercells; and they have quite identical inventory since we only have so many types of computers and powercells. Yes, shop balance is very much desired, but how?
One other factor to take into consideration: the availability of items. I have yet to find any shop that sells the lockpicks or the multiscanner. On the other hand, I am assuming that much more items will be implemented in the long run; greater variety of items will surely change and affect the shopping experience.
Missile launchers, for example--we don't have any. Though personally I find them quite useless in personal scale adventures.
Personally I am waiting for Gundam 00 to be translated.

Offline Burzmali

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« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2008, 07:32:21 am »
Re: Repetitive shops

Would it be a good idea to orient shops to sell themed gear that is only a rename of an existing item?

For example, Joe's Wild West store would sell anything "WEAPON" or "ARMOR"  from faction "GENERAL" that is from category "WEST" or has an alt name for "WEST".  For example:

Melee 7
Name <Longsword>
Alt_WEST <Cavalry Saber>
desc <A long-bladed sword capable of causing large amounts of damage through its swing velocity.>
category <WEAPON MELEE>
factions <GENERAL>
SDL_PORTRAIT <item_longsword.png>
legality 5
Acc 1
Speed 4
Mass -4

Offline Onisuzume

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« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2008, 07:57:18 am »
Well, it'd be one way to do it...

Maybe a greater variaty of non-lethal weapons would also help in that direction.

Oh, and the Alt_EAST version could be a Jian.

Offline Joseph Hewitt

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« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2008, 07:29:04 pm »
I've added some more conversation events, so the "friend joins Aegis" plotline should be less common than before. I've also added a new task: +Tpt, protect the target. You need to locate a NPC and protect him/her from something or another.

I need to decide on a mechanism for the episode state. The plot state avoids repetition by only progressing in a single direction; for the episode state, I thought it would be neat if any given episode state could only be used once. The difficult part is coming up with a decent mechanism for doing this.

Quoting: palefire
Personally I am waiting for Gundam 00 to be translated.

I'm waiting for something new in the Universal Century, although to be fair I guess I shouldn't complain about a lack of new shows when there's oodles and oodles of older UC stuff that I haven't watched yet.