Author Topic: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.  (Read 644 times)

Offline Telok

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Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« on: September 24, 2011, 09:37:06 AM »
These are a batch of very small, very cheap (115,500 pv target) mecha. Personally I feel kinda iffy about them. While they are an excellent source of weapons they don't contribute much to fights. It's very rare for them to actually hit anything and they seem to fall down more often than other mecha. I think that the base program may generate unskilled pilots for low pv mecha, but I can't say for sure.

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B9XsjpBrTFDRM2M5ZDEyNzktZTEzNS00NDdhLTk1ODMtNzUxZjM5OTIxYjIz&authkey=CNr3zowC&hl=en_US&authkey=CNr3zowC

Snake style mecha. I swiped from Elite/FFE for the naming and sizing. Unfortunately they had to be battroids because zoanoids can't mount the wheels/tracks that I felt the larger snakes warranted.

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B9XsjpBrTFDRYmRkMjE2NDMtNzJiNS00YmRlLWJjNTgtY2JlZDFkM2M2MWYx&authkey=CJz42-MK&hl=en_US&authkey=CJz42-MK

General stuff. Shouldn't be anything too much in here except for the DIY robot kit. The Battle Suit is a SF0 version of a pico class battroid, I'll stick that one up later.

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B9XsjpBrTFDRMzFkZWJmMWQtNTNlOC00YjdmLThjYzgtODk5MTZkZjRiYzgy&authkey=CLK1g-EO&hl=en_US&authkey=CLK1g-EO

Lastly I'm currently writing up selected mecha from the BT 3025 tech readout. I've got my light through heavies done with the assault, vehicles, and LAMs still to do. The current list stands at CPLT-C1, CPLT-C2, DRG-1G, MAD-3R, MAD-3M, RFL-3N, BJ-1, HCT-3F, VND-1R, ASN-21, HBK-4G, PHX-1, COM-2D, COM-3A, FS9-H, HSR-300-D, JVN-8F, MON-67, PNT-9R, and VLK-QA. I'm trying to keep from overloading the list with mecha that everyone has, focusing mostly on those that are limited to specific factions. But I have some questions and would like some feedback on this.

1. Copyright.
Should I change the names or is this functionally fanfic where it doesn't matter? Or can I simply add a copyright note to the filesand call it good?

2. Did I miss anyone's slobbering rabid favourites? Keep in mind that I'm not done yet.

3. Factions
Cappellan Confed = L5 Council/Law
Draconis = Aegis
Free Worlds = Free Commerce
Lyrian Commonwealth = Rishiri
Comstar = Silver Knights
Periphery = Bohemians

Are those close enough or did I make any major mistakes in the fluff?

I have an expanded STC_default to handle the BT mecha weapon systems, that will go up later. And there's a slew of other mecha I've written that I am going to just move into a single text file which will go up at that time too.

Comments, critiques?
« Last Edit: September 25, 2011, 01:30:54 AM by Telok »

Offline Telok

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2011, 01:48:48 AM »

Offline Crucifix

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2011, 07:43:01 AM »
I've just glanced at the first file (I'm stuck deep into playing Oblivion lately, really puts a crimp on my game design interests) and I'll make the same comment I've made recently before:

Things do not exist in a vacuum.

Addon: Range +5.

On a weak, range 1 item? Awesome, it's range 6, pretty neat. On a simple M-Rifle? Great, it's now a neat little sniper weapon.

On a Heavy Particle Cannon? It's just given it a maximum range of 156. This means you can pretty well attack any enemy (who will never use the addon outside of this particular mecha where it's balanced/weak) two or three times before they get into weapon range. On an Ink Rifle or other line weapon? Lines increase in width along with range, so with a max range of 80, you're covering most of the battlefield in hard to avoid AOE status effects.... That are brutal.

Addon Armorpiercing and +1 damage? Stick it on any of the HYPER weapons, you've just created a Savin's Breaker Cannon (one of the nastiest toys in the game), potentially on an infinite firing energy weapon, all for the bargain price of a few thousand, since Addons are cheap. Since Armorpiercing pretty much doubles the power of your average weapon (or more, since armour frequently exceeds the health of a part) it's pretty risky including it on a token in the first place.

Checking your personal scale stuff a little.... 1: Neat! Does TR boost software work on personal scale rolls? If so that's a nice little boost, what about MV for dodge rolls?

2: Same warning I gave to Saint - Watch your potency and keep it in line with the game as it exists. An ARMOR IGNORING HYPER BLAST 20 explosion on a *purchasable*, *non-artifact* item is a little extreme, compare it to the Atomic Warclub artifact. A SWARM/LINE/HAYWIRE/SCATTER (Scatter + Line is redundant, Scatter is simply a 1 square AOE, Line is a multiple square AOE, they hit the target identically), will cause, I believe, multiple line effects, again, it's a little much for an infinite use weapon, and giving it BV 9 as well? Compare it, again, to the near-artifact level Antique Plasma - BV 9 in this sense means you're talking about a 90 damage LINE weapon!

3: Since it's a FEDER weapon, you're aware that the Sonic token won't actually show in-game? Also that it's BLAST means you'll be hurting yourself every hit as well? Not much fun if you're attacking with a Night Scythe.

4: You might want to up the armour on your exoskeleton. Armour class 2 is "acrobatics" level armour; such as clothing, or a skinsuit, it's not so much "heavy exoskeleton used by construction workers", compare it to a Saga Suit, or the faction restricted Paladin armour. Secondly - why is it Hardened? An Encounter suit designed for combat encounters isn't hardened, nor is a heavy armour Saga Suit. Why does it boost Perception? Firstly would be why would a construction worker even need Perception, and secondly, why are they wearing gear that puts a state of the art Bunny Suit to shame?

5: You might want to include some power sources in your battle armour (which is in itself a little OTT for me, but I can deal), people don't have engines after all.

6: Great minds, nice to see someone else adding a good old Flamer as well.

7: Minor grammatical - The Blackjack, from one of the files I glanced at at random; "L5 Law's", not "L5Laws'", since it's proper name is singular". That's a very minor thing though, the mecha themselves look well balanced. I'll probably be adding them to my game to test 'em out when I start a new game.

There's some neat stuff in here, some of which is even balanced (and the scout's handbook is an awesome idea anyway), but like Saint, it's the OTT stuff that'd turn people off it that needs to be looked at; "cheat" items are fine, but mixing them in with non-cheat items isn't.

Offline Telok

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2011, 02:30:54 PM »
About the gun add ons from the Defence Drones I think you're right. Which is why I have been keeping them separate and thinking about cutting them down. Besides, the BattleTech stuff adds some nice low PV mecha anyhow.

The personal scale stuff is much better balanced. The ARMOR IGNORING HYPER BLAST 20 is on an illegally hacked counter-gravity body harness. Look closer and try it out in game, it's fun and turns out to not be overpowered. Think about what it is, a modified control dial on a gravity generator, it does what it's supposed to.

Nice catch on the sonic token. It's supposed to have the drawback of hitting yourself but I didn't know why it never showed up. On the same line I can't figure why the sonic screwdriver and maser communication laser never appear, any ideas?

LINE/SWARM is very different from LINE alone, I use it in very specific circumstances. See the L-3 Adom.

I tried putting power sources in the SF0 battle armor. Didn't work. That's why it doesn't have a personalized invincium-gold-diamond emblem on it. Compare to the battroid version if it. On that I'd like to have the armor integrated or stuck as size 1 but couldn't get it to.

The exoskeleton is supposed to be light. It isn't intended as combat armor but as a space construction suit that protects against industrial accidents and debris.

No more time now, but I fixed the Blackjack.

Offline Crucifix

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2011, 12:55:33 AM »
For the armour - Treasure isn't a valid subcomponent I believe is one of your problems, and I'm not sure power sources are as a direct armour component (hopefully the engine will become more robust when personal scale engineering becomes available), but you can definitely get power into the weapon systems easily enough, I'll add a revised suggestion to the bottom of my post with the armour at least working.


As per your other weapons, try adding a Factions line to them, you've missed it on them, and the cyberware leading up to them.

Since I'm looking at them anyway, the Screwdriver looks fine (and hints at the possibility of a fellow fan of one my favourite television programs), the Maser looks insanely overpowered - even with a 10 MP price tag. I'd test it hard, because like I said - DC 90.


My points on the exoskeleton still stand - asides from being lightweight, which is fine, there's a lot of "special" in there that I'd say was too special for something intended for tooling around on a construction site. Who has better gear? A guy in a hard hat or a guy in full military armour? You're talking enhancements at a level of top of the range military hardware on it as it is at the moment.

Concerning "integral" armour - this can't be done because there's already an app for that; it's the Armor tag. Want more integral armour? Give it a higher Armor stat and increase its weight accordingly (if the game doesn't do it for you). You'll have to integrate the actuator into the part, rather than equipment, but that's only fair if you're having it "integral", no?

Code: [Select]
Set
name <Mini Battle Suit [set]>
Desig <M5-a+!>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid for

elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
Factions <general>
Legality 5
inv
BodyArmor 8
mass -6
name <Battle Suit>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid

for elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
Sealed
hardened
antibeam
body 10
sub
heavyactuator 4
end

ArmArmor 8
mass -5
name <Battle Sleeve>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid

for elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
Sealed
hardened
antibeam
reflexes 5
sub
eMelee 5
Name <Laser Lance>
Type <extend>
inv
powersource 2
name <Power Cell 50>
mass -2
end
end

ArmArmor 8
mass -5
name <Battle Sleeve>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid

for elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
Sealed
hardened
antibeam
reflexes 5
sub
beamgun 5
name <Combat Laser>
acc +1
mass -4
inv
powersource 2
name <Power Cell 50>
mass -2
end
end

LegArmor 8
mass -6
name <Battle Legging>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid

for elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
Sealed
hardened
antibeam
speed 5
sub
arcjet 4
mass 1
end

LegArmor 8
mass -6
name <Battle Legging>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid

for elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
hardened
antibeam
Sealed
speed 5
sub
arcjet 4
mass 1
end

HeadArmor 8
mass -6
name <Battle Helm>
desc <A personal size scale model of the high end pico-class battroid

for elite pilots.>
Category <ARMOR SPACE>
Sealed
perception 10
hardened
antibeam
Phone
sub
Beamgun 1
fudge 1499200
range 1
acc -1
name <Impervium diamond-gold personalized emblem.>
desc <So shiny it hurts.>
inv
powersource 1
name <Sparkle Enhancer>
mass -1
end
end

Apologies for any glitches, I just juryrigged up something quick.

Incidentally, it not being hardened is much better than I originally thought at first glance, seems fine, especially since I did make a hardened class 8 mega-armour, this one looks neat.

Offline Telok

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2011, 02:09:20 AM »
I've checked the wiki and I found that I was under a mistaken impression. I thought that BV split up your damage like BLAST and SCATTER. Instead is turns out that BV can multiply your damage instead. I'll have to tweak the Maser. That's unfortunate because I wanted it to be a one shot weapon that drained all your power sources.

Seeing if the factions fixed the gear. (And my mother knit me a scarf to match the screwdriver)

The cyberware without faction tags is part of a 2.5 million credit full borg conversion kit. The first thing I tried with that was multi-slot cyberware with more than three stat adjustments. That didn't work, the kit was the best I could do there.

The exoskeleton isn't military grade, it's class 2. I may strip off the hardened tag.

With the SF2 battle armor there is a hard cap on how much armor a component can have. For a size 1 mecha that cap is 25 points, ARMOR 1. The armor in the design file is already over the cap and has no effect.

I'm wondering if I could kill both of the current battle suits and make a SF0 mecha... That could be bad. I'll try it.

Offline Crucifix

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2011, 03:50:13 AM »
Yeah, BV is a major force multiplier, your adding SCATTER and LINE may increase the energy cost of the device without improving it any, but I'm not certain with that one. A tag that drained all available power and dealt a proportional amount of damage would be awesome though.

Ah, I getcha, missed that the cyberware was in a set. Of course, given the state of cyber dysfunction, it'll probably require a trip to a cyberdoc every five minutes.

Losing Hardened would be a big step, I think that'd do it. I know first-hand that the Skinsuit is one of the best armours in the game (at very least it makes you immune to shotguns and most weenie long-range damage effects, and most of the weaker melee enemies without weapons, so it's nearly perfect for the arena), I stick to skinsuits and other hardened armours in preference to Saga Suits or other more expensive suits, just because the hardened tag is so potent. As for the stat boosts you might want to check out the bunny suit for comparison, since you're giving the helmet at least some better stats than it can get.

Huh, the more you know, I never knew there was a hard cap on armour.

SF0 Mecha? Totally doable, I think Mr Dmonic made one for GH1 awhile back based on the Maximus suit, and you'll be beating me to making one in GH2, where I was going to make a Tanksuit mech variant and some of the other popular SF 0 armours into mech versions. You would basically have to make the entire part infrastructure yourself if you wanted to make it moddable of course, and your carried equipment will murder its MV/TR. Heck, if you were interested in doing them yourself you'd be saving me a job. ;)

Make your mech-file, say "Scale 0" under the Battroid thing. I think that'd do it. Check out my.... Guardian I think, it has the scale in the appropriate spot, just change that one down. Check the Yahoo files area you should be able to find the old (GH1 format) file.

I'd suggest a Head-Cockpit unlike the Maximus Mech-version's torso, since losing your head.... Well.

Offline Telok

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Re: Mecha, stuff, and a work in progress.
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2011, 04:28:43 AM »
I'ma just gonna say 'no' to scale 0 mecha. A size 10, scale 0, version of the battle armor was 56ish kg and something like half the cost of Saga armor. I think (didn't test) that you could maybe wear Saga armor on top of a scale 0 mecha. I'll pass on these, you can fool with them if you want to.

I have tested BV, it does not work exactly like either of us though it did.
The BV # tag adds the # of shots to the default single shot of a gun. So the tag BV 9 gives you a gun that is really BV 10.
Every 2 points of BV that you add to a gun gives you a +1 to hit (phantom accuracy bonus). A BV 8 or 9 tag gives you +4 to hit.
The number of shots that hit depends on how badly the defender rolls. There is a near perfect correlation between the number that the best defence roll fails by and the number of shots that hit. Out of 50+ hits there are two anomalies, but not every roll is reported in <shift-r> and there is very little explanation for some of them.
You can near-miss and still hit. One of the hits was a miss, but the defence roll failed by more than the attack roll did and 2/10 of the burst hit (defence roll was 2 under the attack roll).
Energy weapons do not drain extra energy for BV. This might be an oversight or a bug in the code, ammo guns use the right amount of ammo for a burst.