SF0 weapons attached to mechas.

[clockworkspider]

Thanks for the help, everybody.

Oh, yes.  Someone in Wujung dropped a wallet, but when I picked it up I didn't have time to find who dropped it, and I've been in and out of town a few times since, and no one's giving hints about who might be looking any more.  Is it worth cracking the thing and grabbing the money, or should I just ditch the thing somewhere?

[Frumple]

Cracking the wallet'll effect your... lawful/villainous (sometin' like dat, anyway) reputation, I think, which can have negative consequences later on; mostly, the majority of the characters you interact with will like you less.

There tends to be a decent amount of cash in it, though, so it might be worth it. I generally don't bother opening them if I can't find the original owner (rumors'll say something if they're still looking for it; alternately, you can just go through and talk to the entire population, making a list as you go so you'll know who you've already talked to. GH2 makes keeping track of such things much, much easier.), and I vaguely remember you being able to collect them and turn them into the authorities to improve rep (Though, uh, I might be crossing memories with Elona, where you can do something similar with briefcases...) or something, but you'll probably be long-run better off just not bothering with the thing.

Unless you like collecting them. I did that, sometimes, just for the heck of it. Iirc, there's a building in snake lake you can break into for an extra one

[clockworkspider]

Yeah, one playthrough I ran low on funds and figured "Screw it, I'm going criminal."  Robbed that place and Ipshil's wine cellar.   

On a related note, are there any missions I should avoid if I want to be lawful?  I always help the Guardians whenever I can, but I always end up chaotic.  Not that I mind, it's just I'd like to try joining Kettel or the Guardians one time.

Also, I find the Flesh Pit is a very good place for money, so I don't think I'll have any more money issues from now on.

[Trucidation]

What's the Flesh Pit?

Btw the measly villainous points accrued from cracking a single wallet shouldn't be significant. It's a repeatable quest anyway so it's not like anyone "remembers" you didn't return the wallets, it just dings your alignment which you can easily fix by sucking up to lawful factions.

Heck, I noticed my alignment was going way high into the lawful side since I was doing too many missions (for Guardians, Navy, etc) that they started attempting to recruit me so I started going out of my way to help the less savoury mission givers, just so that I could swing my alignment back to neutral - I haven't joined any faction yet, which may be a mistake since the guides all seem to want you to join one for your own good?

The SF0 cannons are too cumbersome imho, that's why I use 2 rifles. I can keep firing them alternately. Might take a couple shots compared to a cannon's probable 1-hit kill though, but then again more attacks just means I'm putting more time into the related skill right? About dodge, yeah, mine's pretty low and I have been nailed a couple times. Might worry about it later.

I'd been offered to join a corp while at the same time bandits have been giving me missions against that same corp. Heh. I wonder what happens if I actually join the corporation and then do missions against them...

[Frumple]

What's the Flesh Pit?

SF:0 arena in that down around the southern part of the map. Pays pretty well, compared to the SF:2 arenas.

Mind you, the best money maker in GH1 is the SF:0 sewer missions -- you'll want to bring an infinite ranged attack (Beamguns or throwables) and as many deluxe rations as you can; your morale steadily declines as you go deeper, one of the reasons the best town for running sewer missions is that northern one with the spa, to jack your morale back up when you finish the mission. A massive dodge score is requisite as you go deeper (we're talking going up against 20+ critters, many of which will have ranged attacks), too.

The easiest way to get the sewer missions is the chat up towns' mayors -- if they're decently in the green, they'll occasionally e-mail you with the job offer. You get paid depending on how deep you go; eventually, getting 2-3 million a run isn't out of sight -- which probably gets fed right back into skill training, letting you get even deeper.

The SF0 cannons are too cumbersome imho, that's why I use 2 rifles. I can keep firing them alternately. Might take a couple shots compared to a cannon's probable 1-hit kill though, but then again more attacks just means I'm putting more time into the related skill right? About dodge, yeah, mine's pretty low and I have been nailed a couple times. Might worry about it later.

Weight training's easy to pick up (GH1 makes it incredibly easy to pick up pretty much every skill in the game once you start making a decent income), and gas vents are generally the way to go with SF:0 weapons anyway; either that or barrel extensions. The cannon's big thing is the LINE effect, plus the amount of damage it does, which combines with its infinite ammo to be really, really good for late game stuff. Rifles will do fine for a good long time, though.

As a side note, usage XP gains for skills depreciates pretty heavily after the 5th or 6th level; you can get it up to 8 or 9 just via use, but it'll take a bloody long time -- any further than that's not terribly realistic. The primary method of training past around the nines is via skill trainers, converting cash into skill XP. It's one of the reasons high knowledge and charm are so powerful, as KN gets more out of training and a trainer that likes you more gives better results as well (or costs less, I forget which).

I'd been offered to join a corp while at the same time bandits have been giving me missions against that same corp. Heh. I wonder what happens if I actually join the corporation and then do missions against them...

 Try it and find out, heh. I dun remember what the consequences are, if there are any.

[clockworkspider]

Well, my latest playthrough died.  Horribly.

I took a job with Biocorp, then drew the "Biocorp kidnaps Dr. Kim to get at your files" event.  Then I get fired, sending my reputation into utter ruin.  Seriously, "redeem your name" quests against 6M+ enemy groups?

I suppose I could try salvaging it, but I'm not really interested in going there.

[Trucidation]

Ah, the Doctor Kim kidnapping? Yeah that one was a pain. I luck out a lot in combat, although I'm suspecting it's all those points I threw into Spot Weakness. Gas vents? I vaguely remember seeing those, but I went with barrel extensions (prior to that, the red dot sight acc+1 thingy).

Line-type weapons, gotcha. Yeah, I usually need to bail out around 150+ meters in the sewers due to all the ranged critters (I loathe poison and burn), and my rifles really only hit one target at a time. Not to mention if assassins spawn they can really ruin your day. Maybe I'll make my next char a combat medic.

[clockworkspider]

OK, GH2 question.  Is there any way to improve your mecha's MV at all?  Because it doesn't seem worth it to actually customize mechas at all.  The weight penalties from adding computers and the like are just too much.  Is there something I'm missing, and a MV lower than -3 is no longer a death sentence?

[Frumple]

Base MV is still at most 0, barring biomechs (which aren't in the base game, iirc), which can get +1, I think. This is largely a function of the size of the machine, followed by any mass reductions applied to the limbs (in the design file).

There's MV penalty reducing software (Scale two piloting, iirc.), for which the largest reduction is the only one counted; extra software of the same type doesn't increase the reduction, it just adds a redundant piece in case the original gets blown off. There's mass reduced computers (Luna II, Crown, some high end machine I forgot the name of, are the best, but there's lesser ones.) to help with the weight impact of adding computers.

Actuators can, sometimes, reduce the MV impact of adding things to the machine, but I've never really paid attention to the mechanics involved; there's something on it, somewhere on the forum (I think), but you'll have to hunt it down yourself.

All that said, it's definitely worth customizing mecha, still. A lot of the base designs are sub-optimal in ways (The Vadel, ferex, can gain a point or two of MV/TR just by moving its vulcans into the outer limbs.). Switching bits and pieces around (Mounts from the legs to the arms, ferex), adding armor, replacing limbs with lighter/stronger ones, there's still quite a lot you can do to improve the machines. Weapons, of course, still need adjusting to get a truly powerful machine, especially in regards to the themed weapons.

The innovation limit cuts back on some of really out-there stuff GH1 could do, but customization is still intensely powerful, albeit not quite as necessary as it was in GH1. It's certainly easy enough to get a Vadel or a Savin down a few points via judicious parts monkeying.

[clockworkspider]

Thanks a lot.

Is there something that explains, for example, why shuffling the Vulcans on a Vadel (the alliteration!  The goggles do nothing!  ) to the arms would make it more maneuverable?

[Trucidation]

The innovation limit cuts back on some of really out-there stuff GH1 could do, but customization is still intensely powerful, albeit not quite as necessary as it was in GH1. It's certainly easy enough to get a Vadel or a Savin down a few points via judicious parts monkeying.

And I'm thoroughly looking forward to GH2 when I finish GH1. I've been pretty much sticking to a "realistic" design principle, even though it appears that I can have a 5-headed, 20-limbed monstrosity which carries every single rifle type known to man.

Side note, in Titans of Steel players can't tinker with the base frame at all - kinda corresponds to the body piece in GH1 I guess, except it applies to the entire mecha frame - so you can't add / detach limbs, but you could vary armor thickness and armor type per body location (armor came in a few types which you'd choose depending on thickness/weight/hit-dissipation ratios). So you could have a solid mecha with decent all-around armor, or something heavily protected in front and with good heat dissipation but thin armor at the back, or the arms, etc.

Then there's the Front Mission series where adjustment is pretty much confined to weight, although you could interchange parts (e.g. swap arms for those from a lighter model with less armor but more accuracy). Still no additional limb adding like GH and no armor micromanagement like ToS so it's kinda like a gimped GH model where you can only swap out limbs instead of adding more.

I'm not sure how the Armored Core series works but I know it's quite popular. I just can't really dig the realtime fps combat, it's not... celebral enough for my tastes but that's probably just prejudice speaking since I know hardcore AC fans have in-depth discussions on customizing their mechs all the time.

Still, I enjoyed them all in their respective games, I can see how it's hard to balance this kind of thing. Back to GH though, wasn't there something about mounting versus installing? Something like mounting being more versatile and give less of an MV hit although the weapon would be more exposed to damage, something like that?

[Daemonward]

Back to GH though, wasn't there something about mounting versus installing? Something like mounting being more versatile and give less of an MV hit although the weapon would be more exposed to damage, something like that?

From the design file editing guide on the GH wiki(http://gearheadrpg.com/wiki/index.php?title=Guides:Design_file_editing_%28GH1%29):

    "Each mecha type (Battroid, Gerwalk, GroundHugger, etc.) has different base values, which are then penalized for the mass of the mecha:
       
    Type:      MV   TR
    --------------------------
    Battroid   +1   +1
    Zoanoid      +2   -1
    GroundHugger   -1   +2
    Arachnoid   +0   +1
    AeroFighter   -5   -1
    Ornithoid   -1   -2
    Gerwalk      -3   +0
    HoverFighter   -3   +0
    GroundCar   -1   +1

    SE is the same for all mecha types -- it's -8 with no sensor, {Sensor Value} - 7 if one is present. If the sensor is mounted on the head, there is a further +3 bonus."

    "MV is calculated as follows:

       1. Start with a fixed value based on the mecha model. Three factors play into this: mecha type (Zoanoids are best, Aero Fighters worst), whether or not the cockpit is in the head (+1 bonus), and the quality of the Gyroscope (not shown in-game as far as I know, but can be found in the mecha description files).

       2. Take the mecha's intrinsic mass (its weight with empty inventory and equipment) and divide it by 7.5t, rounding down. This is the intrinsic mass penalty. For example, an intrinsic mass of 28t modifies MV by -3, an intrinsic mass of 30t modifies MV by -4.

       3. Take the mecha's inventory mass (everything that is equipped or carried in inventory) and divide it by a value that depends on the size of the mecha, namely (7.5t + 0.5t * size), again rounding down, then subtracting 1 if it is greater than zero. This is the inventory penalty. For example, a Fenris (size 4) will get the first penalty point at a carried weight of 2 * 9.5t = 19t, the second point at 28.5t, and so on.

    There are further modifications in exceptional circumstances (Overloading, Gyroscope destroyed, ...), but this is how it works for a normal, fully repaired mecha.

    TR is calculated in the same way, except that the targetting computer class is used in place of the gyroscope class, and that the fixed bonus for the different mecha types is different. For TR, Groundhuggers are best and Ornithoids worst."

    * You get a -1 MV penalty for every 7.5 extra tons of installed stuff. But, for equipped stuff, the figure depends on mecha size (e.g., 8t for size 1, 8.5t for size 2, 9t for size 3, etc.). Note that Mounts and Hands weigh 0.5t.
    * A gyroscope gets you a +1 MV bonus per level; so a Gyroscope +3 will chage a MV -5 to -3 or -2.
    * Biotech mecha get a +1 to MV and TR.
    * If cockpit is located in head, +1 bonus to MV and TR.

[clockworkspider]

OK, is there any way to force doors open?  Because I'd like to play a character that doesn't jam points into Code Breaking, just to vary things a little.

[Frumple]

Shoot it. Or whack it with a melee weapon. Whatever doesn't take ammo. Might take a few hits. Use the shift-A attack menu if plain a isn't working.

Obviously, if you want to open doors in town, well, you need code breaking. Or a willingness to thereafter slaughter the entire town in an orgy of bloodshed and murder _{or leave, I guess, but that's not as much fun.}

[clockworkspider]

I tried plasma grenading one a few times to no effect.  Should have used a chainsaw, I guess.  Thanks!